Hi all,
Great web-site. Haven't posted before, but appreciate what can be learnt from everyone.
My issue is, being new - the local HB shop keepers 'insist' (and I mean 'insist') that for every kit brew, thou shalt mix, fill fermenter to 3/4 full, let bubble for 2 days, then top up to the base of the neck of the fermenter (I think taking from about 23 litres, up to 25).
I have no problem with this, but they blame every problem that arises on the fact that this might not have been done. They always refer to the avoidance of oxidisation as a reason, with little other explanation.
Now from reading your topics, I haven't seen this to be a constant requirement, but wonder as to your thoughts???
On top of everything, methinks this would also water down the beer.
Cheers for any assistance.
Smiley
Insistent HB shop-keepers
That is just silly...
Not only does it do the opposite as Moby said (the oxygen should be well and truely gone 2 days into fermentation) but it exposes the wort at a very vulnerable point and greatly increases the chance of infection.
I see no benefit of doing this, it will water the beer down and increases the chance of the krausen going out the top and bringing infection to your brew.
Like I said at the start, I could probably go on with more, but this is just silly!
Not only does it do the opposite as Moby said (the oxygen should be well and truely gone 2 days into fermentation) but it exposes the wort at a very vulnerable point and greatly increases the chance of infection.
I see no benefit of doing this, it will water the beer down and increases the chance of the krausen going out the top and bringing infection to your brew.
Like I said at the start, I could probably go on with more, but this is just silly!
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Trough Lolly
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Welcome to the forum, Smiley...
Your shop keepers are, quite simply, wrong. There are a host of reasons why you don't do this...first and foremost, the HBS is ignoring what the yeast is doing in the first few days of primary fermentation. You should NOT add any more volume of water since you would be fundamentally changing the composition of the wort that the yeast has spent the last few days adapting to.
In addition to the risk of infection, you'd be diluting the fermented beer and unless you took that into account and started with a relatively high gravity wort, it would not help the flavour profile of the finished beer either.
I'm surprised a HBS person would recommend or even practice this method - it's a very bad move. Are you sure that they weren't talking about fresh wort kits and adding water to them in the fermenter???
Cheers,
TL
Your shop keepers are, quite simply, wrong. There are a host of reasons why you don't do this...first and foremost, the HBS is ignoring what the yeast is doing in the first few days of primary fermentation. You should NOT add any more volume of water since you would be fundamentally changing the composition of the wort that the yeast has spent the last few days adapting to.
In addition to the risk of infection, you'd be diluting the fermented beer and unless you took that into account and started with a relatively high gravity wort, it would not help the flavour profile of the finished beer either.
I'm surprised a HBS person would recommend or even practice this method - it's a very bad move. Are you sure that they weren't talking about fresh wort kits and adding water to them in the fermenter???
Cheers,
TL
Very Interesting......
Sorry, I meant funny............Telling people to avoid Oxidisation, then telling them to crack open the lid and fill with water, which is more than likely to lead to infection.........and oxidisation if it gets swished around.IMO
Are they new to the HB shop? If so they had better do a little bit of research before giving advice, like Palmers book.
Cheers
Boonie
Sorry, I meant funny............Telling people to avoid Oxidisation, then telling them to crack open the lid and fill with water, which is more than likely to lead to infection.........and oxidisation if it gets swished around.IMO
Are they new to the HB shop? If so they had better do a little bit of research before giving advice, like Palmers book.
Cheers
Boonie
A homebrew is like a fart, only the brewer thinks it's great.
Give me a flying headbutt.......
Give me a flying headbutt.......
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Cortez The Killer
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wildschwein
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Incompetenece is a abundant in many businesses, Home brewing included. I've seen people in the forums with all sorts of questionable ideas which they have been told by their HB shop staff - like the belief that every single HB kit comes with an ale yeast and there is no exceptions. This is just dead wrong.gibbocore wrote:2 words
chinese whispers
no business owner can be that silly
Here's something that has nothing to do with beer but everything to do with incompetence in businesses. Recently I went to Godfrey's - the so-called vaccuum cleaner specialists - and I asked the guy at the desk for vaccuum bags for a Dustflo 1200. He was rude and acted like I was interupting his slacking off - there was no-one else in the shop. He looked through his book to find out which bags to give me. He didn't give me a reciept for the $15 purchase (gets you 5 bags) as I trusted he was an expert at getting the right bags for the right model. As, this is where we bought the vaccuum from. Wrong!! - when I got home the bags did not fit and were not for my model - they were for a Dustflo 2000. f---ing cockhead loser.
That's what drove me into retirement. Incompetence on the part of the NSW State Govt authority overseeing our business, and the plain dishonesty and intellectual sophistry of a huge number of lawyers, and even judges.wildschwein wrote:Incompetence is a abundant in many businesses.
Having said that, there is a lot of very good and helpful information available on this forum (and others), provided you are willing to look at anything that's said with a practical and critical eye.
Given time, you get to recognise the contributors you can rely on.
Hello again all
Again, thanks for the replies.
In answer to your questions I thought of posting the link to their website, but thought that would probably not be the done thing. Nevertheless, to top up after 2 days fermenting is absolutely what they say.
It is the only HB shop in the city, has been open quite a while, but some friends and I have boycotted them through their basic rudeness and narrow-minded views, and travel further to another shop willing to give great ideas. I just wanted to know what you all have told me.
Best thing is, you've all obviously been good teachers, because it differed to everything I have read in the millions of topics on this site.
Cheers again
Smiley
Again, thanks for the replies.
In answer to your questions I thought of posting the link to their website, but thought that would probably not be the done thing. Nevertheless, to top up after 2 days fermenting is absolutely what they say.
It is the only HB shop in the city, has been open quite a while, but some friends and I have boycotted them through their basic rudeness and narrow-minded views, and travel further to another shop willing to give great ideas. I just wanted to know what you all have told me.
Best thing is, you've all obviously been good teachers, because it differed to everything I have read in the millions of topics on this site.
Cheers again
Smiley
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wildschwein
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Yes I agree with this...the info in this forum is often more detailed, more accurate and more thought out than some of the info you can receive in HB shops. They're intersted in the lowest common denominater when it comes to explaining things. Here, and in other HB forums the detail is highly specialised and at the same time diverse.warra48 wrote:...there is a lot of very good and helpful information available on this forum (and others), provided you are willing to look at anything that's said with a practical and critical eye. Given time, you get to recognise the contributors you can rely on.wildschwein wrote:Incompetence is a abundant in many businesses.
Spot on, Wildschwein (gotta love the name, feral pig). The last time i was in my local HB shop I bought some cans of unhopped malt extract, and the guy was amazed I used them for brewing without a kit to go with it.wildschwein wrote:the info in this forum is often more detailed, more accurate and more thought out than some of the info you can receive in HB shops. They're interested in the lowest common denominater when it comes to explaining things. Here, and in other HB forums the detail is highly specialised and at the same time diverse.
Since moving into AG brewing, Ross now gets all my business.
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wildschwein
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Yeah that's the literal translation of the noun but the feminie version Wildesau has an older kind of vernacular meaning as an adjective which could loosley be translated into English as "loose canon." This was used to describe someone who didn't follow the norm or thought outside the box. Roughly speaking anyway.warra48 wrote:wildschwein wrote:Spot on, Wildschwein (gotta love the name, feral pig).