Northern brown recipe

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timmy
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Northern brown recipe

Post by timmy »

Hi all,

I've had a request to make a sorta Newcastle brown ale and wanted to run a recipe by you lot to see what you think. I've got a couple of Pale Ale kits going spare (a Coopers and a Cascade) and was going to use one of them as a base for the brown. So here's what I'm thinking:

1.7kg Pale Ale tin
250g Crystal, steeped
50g Choc Malt, steeped
500g LDME
250g Brown Sugar
250g Dex
Fuggles for flavour
Wyeast London Ale yeast (1028 I think)
Laxatives (or maybe it's just the way Newky brown affects me... :? )
Filled to 23L

I also have the remnants of a tin of Tate & Lyles golden syrup that I reckon might be nice to add, but I was wondering if I need to adjust the bitterness for this (or to put it another way, am I likely to get any residual sweetness from it after fermentation?).

Any comments/suggestions are welcome.

Cheers,

Tim
Chris
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by Chris »

That won't be all that brown. Consider more choc, or better yet, go amber or dark LME.

That should be sweet. Add 100g more crystal if you really want to boost it a bit.
A beer in the hand is worth two in George Bush...

"They say beer will make me dumb. It are go good with pizza"
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Trough Lolly
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by Trough Lolly »

I agree with Chris - I'd drop the dex and steep 150g of Bairds Amber malt at 66C if you can get it...

Cheers,
TL
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sponge
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by sponge »

i recently made a grain + extract brown ale and i used 250g medium crystal and 150g choc. using medium crystal will give u a darker colour then just using pale crystal, that is, if you havent already got pale crystal, then just use that and use a darker ME.
timmy
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by timmy »

Thanks lads.

I was going to do this with the supplies I have. I only have some crystal, choc, black patent and cara wheat for specialty grains. I'll up the choc malt and see how I go. 150g of choc does seem a bit much IMO.

Also - any thoughts on the residual sugars in the golden syrup?

Cheers,

Tim
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Trough Lolly
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by Trough Lolly »

Go for it - I use Tate and Lyles golden syrup in my ESB's, Milds and Browns with great results...

Cheers,
TL
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dragonphoenix73
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by dragonphoenix73 »

sponge wrote:i recently made a grain + extract brown ale and i used 250g medium crystal and 150g choc. using medium crystal will give u a darker colour then just using pale crystal, that is, if you havent already got pale crystal, then just use that and use a darker ME.

Hey sponge,

Have you posted up your recpie anywhere? I'd love to have a perusal, as I am planning to pop out a Northern Brown in the next couple of weeks or so....

:)
Life is like a box of chocolates.... sometimes you get a hard one!
sponge
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by sponge »

Amount Item Type % or IBU
3.00 kg Pale Liquid Extract (8.0 SRM) Extract 84.51 %
0.25 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt - 10L (10.0 SRM) Grain 7.04 %
0.15 kg Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 4.23 %
0.15 kg Chocolate Malt (450.0 SRM) Grain 4.23 %
45.00 gm Fuggles [4.50 %] (60 min) Hops 16.5 IBU
30.00 gm Fuggles [4.50 %] (20 min) Hops 6.6 IBU
15.00 gm Fuggles [4.50 %] (5 min) (Aroma Hop-Steep) Hops -
1 Pkgs Nottingham Yeast (Lallemand #-) Yeast-Ale


OG: 1050 – 29/2/08
FG: 1012 – 7/3/08


As you can tell, its only been bottled for around 3 weeks, so i was going to give it til the end of april til i tried one so sorry i cant give any feedback on it yet. I had a try from the sample but i didnt write any notes down on how it tasted. if i remember correctly it was a pretty nice rich amber sort of colour which i was pretty happy with


Sponge
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drsmurto
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by drsmurto »

timmy wrote:Hi all,

I've had a request to make a sorta Newcastle brown ale and wanted to run a recipe by you lot to see what you think. I've got a couple of Pale Ale kits going spare (a Coopers and a Cascade) and was going to use one of them as a base for the brown. So here's what I'm thinking:

1.7kg Pale Ale tin
250g Crystal, steeped
50g Choc Malt, steeped
500g LDME
250g Brown Sugar
250g Dex
Fuggles for flavour
Wyeast London Ale yeast (1028 I think)
Laxatives (or maybe it's just the way Newky brown affects me... :? )
Filled to 23L

I also have the remnants of a tin of Tate & Lyles golden syrup that I reckon might be nice to add, but I was wondering if I need to adjust the bitterness for this (or to put it another way, am I likely to get any residual sweetness from it after fermentation?).

Any comments/suggestions are welcome.

Cheers,

Tim
Lived in Durham (20 mins from Newcastle) for 2 years so drank my fair share of the broon. A nice drop, no Landlord mind you but a tasty drop all the same!

Its actually a blend of 2 beers, an old ale and a mild they blend together........

Medium or dark crystal, some choc and throw in the golden syrup. The recipes i have looked through also mention a small black patent addition......

Little to no hop flavour and aroma so hopping is up to you, i would be tempted to throw in some fuggles.

IBUs are supposedly 25ish so the kit is probably right on the money.

Yeast - not as important compared to ESBs, well, IMHO only. 1028 might throw up too many esters......
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earle
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by earle »

The BYO clone brews magazine book has a recipe for Newcastle brown along the lines you mention Doc. Two different brews that are blended together.
timmy
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by timmy »

Good point about the yeasts, Doc.

Might try a dry yeast seeing as my Wyeast smacker has failed to puff up. Any suggestions as to the strain, or should I just pitch the Coopers kit yeast?

Cheers again,
Tim
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drsmurto
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by drsmurto »

S-04 or nottingham maybe. Coopers kit yeast might be stretching it tho. If you can keep temps to no more than 18 then you might be ok. Just dont add any aroma hops to this, it should be malt malt malt.
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Trough Lolly
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by Trough Lolly »

....+1 vote here for Nottingham.

Cheers,
TL
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earle
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by earle »

Recently made this, was aiming for something else but reckon it turned out more like a brown.

Morgans Royal Oak Amber Ale
1.5kg Amber Liquid malt
small amount of Carafa Special I
Willamette for some extra bitterness and aroma
Windsor yeast

Even though its high on IBU for a brown with the kit and extra hops, the sweetness of all the amber malt really cuts back the perceived bitterness

What do people reckon about Windsor v Nottingham
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Trough Lolly
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by Trough Lolly »

Switch the windsor yeast for some US-05 and you'd have a Fat Tire clone!

Cheers,
TL
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earle
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by earle »

Well I was actually aiming for a JSAA but on tasting it decided it had too much carafa for this. It seems to me that amber ales and brown ales are very closely related. Apart from colour what is the difference between the two?
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Trough Lolly
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by Trough Lolly »

Taste wise some versions can be very similar.
Technically, they're quite different in many ways. That can have different malt, hops and yeast profiles and combinations. And I haven't even touched on the differences between Amber ales and Brown ales, themselves. You can have a Southern English Brown and a Northern English Brown and American Brown etc etc... :shock:

For example, here are the BJCP guidelines on US Amber and UK Brown ales:
10B. American Amber Ale
Aroma: Low to moderate hop aroma from dry hopping or late kettle additions of American hop varieties. A citrusy hop character is common, but not required. Moderately low to moderately high maltiness balances and sometimes masks the hop presentation, and usually shows a moderate caramel character. Esters vary from moderate to none. No diacetyl.
Appearance: Amber to coppery brown in color. Moderately large off-white head with good retention. Generally quite clear, although dry-hopped versions may be slightly hazy.
Flavor: Moderate to high hop flavor from American hop varieties, which often but not always has a citrusy quality. Malt flavors are moderate to strong, and usually show an initial malty sweetness followed by a moderate caramel flavor (and sometimes other character malts in lesser amounts). Malt and hop bitterness are usually balanced and mutually supportive. Fruity esters can be moderate to none. Caramel sweetness and hop flavor/bitterness can linger somewhat into the medium to full finish. No diacetyl.
Mouthfeel: Medium to medium-full body. Carbonation moderate to high. Overall smooth finish without astringency often associated with high hopping rates. Stronger versions may have a slight alcohol warmth.
Overall Impression: Like an American pale ale with more body, more caramel richness, and a balance more towards malt than hops (although hop rates can be significant).
History: Known simply as Red Ales in some regions, these beers were popularized in the hop-loving Northern California and the Pacific Northwest areas before spreading nationwide.
Comments: Can overlap in color with American pale ales. However, American amber ales differ from American pale ales not only by being usually darker in color, but also by having more caramel flavor, more body, and usually being balanced more evenly between malt and bitterness. Should not have a strong chocolate or roast character that might suggest an American brown ale (although small amounts are OK).
Ingredients: Pale ale malt, typically American two-row. Medium to dark crystal malts. May also contain specialty grains which add additional character and uniqueness. American hops, often with citrusy flavors, are common but others may also be used. Water can vary in sulfate and carbonate content.
Vital Statistics: OG: 1.045 – 1.060
IBUs: 25 – 40 FG: 1.010 – 1.015
SRM: 10 – 17 ABV: 4.5 – 6.2%
Commercial Examples: North Coast Red Seal Ale, Tröegs HopBack Amber Ale, Deschutes Cinder Cone Red, Pyramid Broken Rake, St. Rogue Red Ale, Anderson Valley Boont Amber Ale, Lagunitas Censored Ale, Avery Redpoint Ale, McNeill’s Firehouse Amber Ale, Mendocino Red Tail Ale, Bell's Amber
11C. Northern English Brown Ale
Aroma: Light, sweet malt aroma with toffee, nutty and/or caramel notes. A light but appealing fresh hop aroma (UK varieties) may also be noticed. A light fruity ester aroma may be evident in these beers, but should not dominate. Very low to no diacetyl.
Appearance: Dark amber to reddish-brown color. Clear. Low to moderate off-white to light tan head.
Flavor: Gentle to moderate malt sweetness, with a nutty, lightly caramelly character and a medium-dry to dry finish. Malt may also have a toasted, biscuity, or toffee-like character. Medium to medium-low bitterness. Malt-hop balance is nearly even, with hop flavor low to none (UK varieties). Some fruity esters can be present; low diacetyl (especially butterscotch) is optional but acceptable.
Mouthfeel: Medium-light to medium body. Medium to medium-high carbonation.
Overall Impression: Drier and more hop-oriented that southern English brown ale, with a nutty character rather than caramel.
History/Comments: English brown ales are generally split into sub-styles along geographic lines.
Ingredients: English mild ale or pale ale malt base with caramel malts. May also have small amounts darker malts (e.g., chocolate) to provide color and the nutty character. English hop varieties are most authentic. Moderate carbonate water.
Vital Statistics: OG: 1.040 – 1.052
IBUs: 20 – 30 FG: 1.008 – 1.013
SRM: 12 – 22 ABV: 4.2 – 5.4%
Commercial Examples: Newcastle Brown Ale, Samuel Smith’s Nut Brown Ale, Riggwelter Yorkshire Ale, Wychwood Hobgoblin, Tröegs Rugged Trail Ale, Alesmith Nautical Nut Brown Ale, Avery Ellie’s Brown Ale, Goose Island Nut Brown Ale, Samuel Adams Brown Ale
Cheers,
TL
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earle
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by earle »

I follow what you're saying especially about the subtypes. I guess what I was really getting at (and why I put the question about style on the JSAA thread also) was that I was aiming for a JSAA (which I don't think is an american amber ale due to hop profile) but by adding a little too much carafa ended up with something closer to the English Brown as per the guidelines - pale base malts with caramel malts and a little dark malt and english hops.
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earle
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Re: Northern brown recipe

Post by earle »

Did a bit of reading last night to satisfy my curiosity. The book I was reading described Irish Red Ale as a variant of English Browns, and I have read before that amber ales are a development of Red Ales. So I figure while they are definitely different styles there may be some basis for my thought that they share some similarities as well.
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