White Labs yeast starter

[banger]

Have just bought a WLP500 Abbey Ale yeast, and given the cost would like to stretch it across as many brews as possible. So I'm looking to make a starter, but am a bit confused as to how to go about it, as I've not made one before.

I'm thinking I'll boil up say 100g of LDME in 500 ml of water, cool the mix and then 'pitch' a third of the WLP 500 yeast onto this, and let it ferment away. After this mix has fully fermented am i right in thinking I can just pitch this fermented mixture onto my brew (a Duvel clone - so pretty high alcohol content)? how long should I leave the starter before pitching? And am I on the right track??

Cheers all...

BTW can you make a yeast starter from Duvel dregs - assume this beer is bottle conditioned?

[mobydick]

What I have done is dissolve 100grams of LDME in about 1 litre of water. I use a 2 litre cordial bottle for this (washed and sterlized). Pitch at about 25 - 30 degrees. Let it ferment for 2 - 3 days. Then resuspend the yeast (shake it up a bit) and bottle into 6 stubbies and cap. Each will be about a third full. Stick them in the fridge to stop any further fermentation. (you could use one straight away if needed).

When you want to use them, make a starter with some LDME and warm water, then shake up the stubbie of yeast (it will have settled) and add to the starter. By the time you have finished boiling your wort it's ready to pitch.

[brew.exe]

I do the same thing only I make mine 1.5 liters and use 150grams of ldme then split into six stubbies, then when I need one I just make another starter the same way. Ferment for 2 - 3 days crash cool it to drop the yeast, then pull it out and let it warm to room temp for an ale, and pour off most of the liquid ‘beer’. Give it a good swirl to resuspend the yeast and pitch it.

[Kevnlis]

I would suggest using no more than 100g per litre of water in the starter. I use less than that and usually put 100g in a 1.5L starter. I also aerate it very well and put it on a stir plate which helps considerably.

[banger]

Cheers guys,

So should i pitch the entire vial of WLP yeast into the 1-1.5 ltr mix of water and LDME, let it ferment out and then split into say 6 stubbies? How do you guys let the gas escape from the cordial/softdrink bottles you use?

[brew.exe]

Yes, just pitch the entire vile let it ferment and then split it up. I use an Erlenmeyer flask and just put some gladwrap and a rubber band over it, the gas just escapes out the sides of it when some pressure builds up. Or you could get a rubber bung and an air lock for it.

[warra48]

I might be doing it wrong, but I start with about 50 gr to 500 mils with a few hop pellets, add 100 gr to 1000 mils the next day, and another 150 to 1500 mil the following day to get to a total of 3 litres. I don't have a stir plate or an Erlenmeyer flask, but I use a 3 litre juice bottle with an airlock built into the cap. I do frequently swirl the bottle to dislodge the CO², and at each addition I shake the hell out of it to get oxygen into it. I cold chill it once it's done, to drop most of the yeast down, and pour off a large portion of the starter beer. I split it into 6 250 mil bottles and store them in the fridge. These are used to build new starters as described above and I pitch mostly only the slurry. So far, it has worked very well.

[Trough Lolly]

Spot on warra48 - stepping up the starter is an excellent way to make yeast since you're continually asking the yeast to go through the adaptive phase as the fresh wort additions are added to the container - this ensures that the yeast is growing in numbers and whilst it's a bit more effort, you will end up with much more yeast after a few days compared to a single starter addition. This is also my preferred method for building up a large active and viable lager yeast starter for my lager fermentations.

Cheers,
TL

[rwh]

Here is my method of making yeast starters.

Using a stir plate is also a great way to boost yeast numbers.

A stir plate provides good gas exchange, keeps the yeast in suspension and drives off CO2, all of which increases yeast growth (around 2 to 3 times as much yeast as a non-stirred starter).

Fourteen essential questions about yeast starters
Yeast Starter - With Stirring Aeration

[banger]

Afternoon all,

Sorry to drag this back up again, but i finally got around to making my starter yesterday as per the advice above. It's been in the 2L bottle for about 24 hrs now, but still no action.

Should i be leaving this a bit longer, should I give it a good hard shake to get things moving, or what? The temperature seems OK to me, the 'wort' and the yeast were about room temperature when I put them in the bottle..

Thanks again

Banger

[Kevnlis]

Yeah mate, shake it every time you remember to.

[rwh]

Don't shake it. Swirl it. You don't need any additional oxygen after it starts up. As for the lag, there isn't all that much you can do at this point other than wait.

[banger]

OK....Happy days, fermentation appears to have taken place, although there was liitle to no krausen on top of the wort. However when I swirled it round, it sort of fizzed up like lemonade (or beer for that matter).

Anyway, I think fermentation is complete, so will split this into 3-4 bottles tonight. If i make my beer tonight, can I pitch say a quarter of this mixture straight onto this wort (as it will still be at room temp), or should I make another starter to get things going? Cheers to all who have held my hand through this

[Kevnlis]

I am assuming you are making a high gravity beer with this yeast. Considering your method for making the starter I would pitch the entire thing. Put it in the fridge to flocculate the yeast out of suspension, pour the liquid off the top leaving just enough to re-suspend the yeast, let it come back to room temp and then pitch it all to the well aerated wort.

[banger]

Kev,

You're right I will be making a high gravity beer. However, the whole idea of making a starter in the first place was to be able to split the relatively expensive cost of the yeast across 3-4 brews.

Are you suggesting that with the size of the starter I've made the yeast won't have multiplied enough to handle a brew with an OG of around 1075? Should I perhaps increase the size of the starter to boost the yeast population?

Banger

[Kevnlis]

Size does not matter as much as the method used. I would be concerned that you would be stressing the yeast even if you pitched the entire starter at that gravity. You can always harvest from the trub or pitch a fresh wort to the trub when you are finished. Splinting a starter is not the only way...

[brew.exe]

Personally I like to make a starter and spit it up into 6 because you can then make more beers with the same generation yeast. I know that this has been asked I think it was Kevnlis, is a starter counted as one generation. So if you buy yeast and make a starter split it and make other one to pitch what generation is it?

[Kevnlis]

The starter counts as the first generation, so if you harvested from the trub it would be second generation yeast, but in the grand scheme of things this will have no major impact on your beer. I use my yeast several times and have a reason to worry about generations.

The only time I would recommend splitting the pitchable or smacker is when using a large stir plate to grow your starter.

In this instance I feel it would be necessary for him to pitch all of the yeast. Harvesting from the trub is easy enough to do.

[rwh]

In this situation, I'd make a starter, split 6 ways, put 5 in the fridge and make a second starter from the 6th. Then cold pitch the slurry from that. But then again, I have a stir plate.

[Kevnlis]

I thought cold pitching was only for harvested yeast... This guy seems to think not... I may give it a go with a starter and see what happens.

Cheers for that rwh!