Hi Brewers,
I've got into the habit of, when drinking pales, just leaving the dregs and doing a yeast culture ready for use at some point in my brews.
I've drilled a hole in a jam jar and fixed an airlock too so it I can see what it's doing (as opposed to in the bottle).
Just wondering how long this yeast will last, and when is the optimum time to use it.
Also, optimum storage temperature. Currently I'm storing them at 18-22.
Cheers
Coopers yeast culture - storage and lifespan
The optimal time to use it is either the whole thing at high krausen, or just the slurry a day or two after it's finished ferementing (i.e. pour off the liquid).
You can make a yeast starter, store it in the fridge for a few months, then pour off the liquid and make another starter from it, and pitch that. Should remain viable for six months or more.
I'm sick of culturing up Coopers yeasts (takes too long and I'm lazy) so I bottled the slurry from my last brew. There should be more than enough yeast in that slurry to get my next one off to a decent start!
You can make a yeast starter, store it in the fridge for a few months, then pour off the liquid and make another starter from it, and pitch that. Should remain viable for six months or more.
I'm sick of culturing up Coopers yeasts (takes too long and I'm lazy) so I bottled the slurry from my last brew. There should be more than enough yeast in that slurry to get my next one off to a decent start!
w00t!
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breadnbutter
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- Location: Perth, WA
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BierMeister
- Posts: 255
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- Location: Adelaide
the main problems with reculturing too many times is the opportunity for infection or problems of generational effects of not having the correct amounts of nutrients for the yeast in one generation effecting the following generations. Ie too much zinc can cause problems in future generations.
I hope that you aren't drinking from the bottle and then reculturing the left over yeast? Bacteria from the mouth would be a disaster.
I wouldn't reculture more than a couple of times unless you can be sure of sanitization and the right sort of nutrients for the yeast. ie All grain would be fine or at least partial grain with all malt extracts
I hope that you aren't drinking from the bottle and then reculturing the left over yeast? Bacteria from the mouth would be a disaster.
I wouldn't reculture more than a couple of times unless you can be sure of sanitization and the right sort of nutrients for the yeast. ie All grain would be fine or at least partial grain with all malt extracts
Sounds like Beer O'clock.
BierMeister, I don't normally drink from the bottle, however I have once or twice lately. Then I've been pouring it into another container. 
Haven't really looked at reculturing, and probably won't, after all it's no more effort to buy some beer and drink it.
rwh, when you talk about pouring the slurry, do you just pour the last couple of centimetres or is there any good way of getting the yeast sediment off the absolute bottom?
Haven't really looked at reculturing, and probably won't, after all it's no more effort to buy some beer and drink it.
rwh, when you talk about pouring the slurry, do you just pour the last couple of centimetres or is there any good way of getting the yeast sediment off the absolute bottom?
Coopers.
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breadnbutter
- Posts: 71
- Joined: Friday Oct 13, 2006 10:19 am
- Location: Perth, WA
Pale_Ale; I can't find the reference right now (a google on washing trub will find something) but the method I use is:
1. Once you're down to the slurry after racking/ bottling, resuspend the trub and half-fill a couple of 750ml sterile bottles.
2. Top up with ice-cold boiled water, cap, invert a couple of times to mix and store in fridge overnight. The fat, dead yeast and protein will settle leaving viable yeast in suspension.
3. Transfer the suspension, half fillling fresh bottles and repeat above (now you may need 4 bottles as you have a larger volume, otherwise discard half).
4. You can now store this in the fridge (I've not stored longer than 4 weeks but may be viable longer?) or if you're keen, repeat again.
5. When ready to make a starter, I just resuspend the whole bottle and add to 750ml sterile starter wort (2 Tbls/ cup, boiled 15 min and cooled) in a 1.5L sterile bottle, plug with an airlock and ferment til krausen (1-3 days) at ~24C.
If anyone picks up any discrepancies or can offer improvements I'd be keen to hear. It does work though.
Cheers
1. Once you're down to the slurry after racking/ bottling, resuspend the trub and half-fill a couple of 750ml sterile bottles.
2. Top up with ice-cold boiled water, cap, invert a couple of times to mix and store in fridge overnight. The fat, dead yeast and protein will settle leaving viable yeast in suspension.
3. Transfer the suspension, half fillling fresh bottles and repeat above (now you may need 4 bottles as you have a larger volume, otherwise discard half).
4. You can now store this in the fridge (I've not stored longer than 4 weeks but may be viable longer?) or if you're keen, repeat again.
5. When ready to make a starter, I just resuspend the whole bottle and add to 750ml sterile starter wort (2 Tbls/ cup, boiled 15 min and cooled) in a 1.5L sterile bottle, plug with an airlock and ferment til krausen (1-3 days) at ~24C.
If anyone picks up any discrepancies or can offer improvements I'd be keen to hear. It does work though.
Cheers
I have a drinking problem... two hands and only one mouth.
I use a bored rubber bung with an airlock. After a few days chewing through some malt, I put them in the fridge (with the airlock) to slow down their metabolism. Once it slows signifigantly, I put in an unbored bung and keep in the fridge. I recon 3 months is best before needing to use them. If you want, at 3 months, bring to room temp, and give them another feed.
You also can freeze yeast if you add glycerol to the medium as you cool them down. I only recon 6 months storage though.
It's easier sometimes to just buy Coopers Pale a day or two prior to brewing.
You also can freeze yeast if you add glycerol to the medium as you cool them down. I only recon 6 months storage though.
It's easier sometimes to just buy Coopers Pale a day or two prior to brewing.
Chris, you have the storage/preservation going pretty well!
rwh, when I said slurry I meant the bottom of a bottle culture, I spose what 'm getting at is do you want the stuff at the very bottom or is that useless? If it is worth getting, what methods do people employ to get the very bottom sediment into their brew.
rwh, when I said slurry I meant the bottom of a bottle culture, I spose what 'm getting at is do you want the stuff at the very bottom or is that useless? If it is worth getting, what methods do people employ to get the very bottom sediment into their brew.
Coopers.
Oh I see... yeah, if you're waiting for the yeast starter to completely ferment out, then the yeast go dormant and settle out of solution. So almost all the yeast cells are in the slurry, and the liquid is just strange-tasting non-beer.
So what you want to do is pour off the liquid, then pitch the slurry. You can do that by just pouring most of it off, then shaking/swirling to get the slurry resuspended, then pitch that. You could also add clean water if it helps you resuspend the slurry.
So what you want to do is pour off the liquid, then pitch the slurry. You can do that by just pouring most of it off, then shaking/swirling to get the slurry resuspended, then pitch that. You could also add clean water if it helps you resuspend the slurry.
w00t!
Ok, so it possible to pitch that yeast well after the wort's fermented out? If so, how long would the yeast last at room temperature with little to no sugar left to ferment?
And if you store it in the fridge, what steps would you take prior to refrigerating (i.e would it be fermented out?) and what steps would be taken once the yeast is to be used (i.e would you take it back to room temperature then pitch or is there more to it?)
I've been storing mine at room temp but have noticed mild activity when the wort is swirled a bit...
And if you store it in the fridge, what steps would you take prior to refrigerating (i.e would it be fermented out?) and what steps would be taken once the yeast is to be used (i.e would you take it back to room temperature then pitch or is there more to it?)
I've been storing mine at room temp but have noticed mild activity when the wort is swirled a bit...
Coopers.
Once a starter has fermented out, you would want to pour the liquid off and either use it after a few days (left at room temp), or put it in the fridge. Its viability would drop fairly quickly if left at room temp, but might be measured in days to weeks I suppose.
If you're storing it in the fridge, the procedure is to take it out of the fridge, make a new starter, and either pitch the lot at high krausen, or the slurry only once it's fermented out (are you seeing a pattern here?).
So yes, you want to wait for it to ferment out, then seal and put in the fridge. That mild activity when you swirl is just CO2 coming out of solution.
If you're storing it in the fridge, the procedure is to take it out of the fridge, make a new starter, and either pitch the lot at high krausen, or the slurry only once it's fermented out (are you seeing a pattern here?).
So yes, you want to wait for it to ferment out, then seal and put in the fridge. That mild activity when you swirl is just CO2 coming out of solution.
w00t!
Ok, so once it's fermented out you'd advise pouring off the fermented sugars and sealing it, then using it within a few days thereafter if at room temperature, or refrigerating and doing another starter? Have I got it right?
I have just opened a bottle culture that has been at room temp for a couple of weeks. When I poured off the excess, I swirled the bottle a little and the remaining liquid and yeast became very murky. Is this yeast viable or is it dead? Is there any way to tell?
I have just opened a bottle culture that has been at room temp for a couple of weeks. When I poured off the excess, I swirled the bottle a little and the remaining liquid and yeast became very murky. Is this yeast viable or is it dead? Is there any way to tell?
Coopers.
YepPale_Ale wrote:Ok, so once it's fermented out you'd advise pouring off the fermented sugars and sealing it, then using it within a few days thereafter if at room temperature, or refrigerating and doing another starter? Have I got it right?
You can tell by adding some more fermentables, say a tablespoon of LDME boiled in a little water, giving it a shake, and seeing if it reactivates.I have just opened a bottle culture that has been at room temp for a couple of weeks. When I poured off the excess, I swirled the bottle a little and the remaining liquid and yeast became very murky. Is this yeast viable or is it dead? Is there any way to tell?
w00t!
Thanks rwh, huge help.
A few final thoughts....do you have to dissolve the ldm and what does this achieve? And does this mean let's say you did a culture but didn't get time to put down the brew...could you keep feeding the yeast, leaving the culture at room temp and letting it eat the sugar as you put it in...this way you can keep it active long enough to then pitch it at room temp without refrigerating and restarting. Is there any problem in doing this?
A few final thoughts....do you have to dissolve the ldm and what does this achieve? And does this mean let's say you did a culture but didn't get time to put down the brew...could you keep feeding the yeast, leaving the culture at room temp and letting it eat the sugar as you put it in...this way you can keep it active long enough to then pitch it at room temp without refrigerating and restarting. Is there any problem in doing this?
Coopers.
Sure you could keep it alive that way. You can't do it indefinitely though as eventually the alcohol level will get high enough to kill the yeast. You'd need to let it complete, pour off the liquid and create a new starter from it at some stage.
Yes, you would want to dissolve the LDME by boiling it in some water, then cooling and adding to the starter, so that it's completely sanitary.
Yes, you would want to dissolve the LDME by boiling it in some water, then cooling and adding to the starter, so that it's completely sanitary.
w00t!