First Partial

[Gill]

Hey guys,
I'm thinking of trying out a partial, and feel like being a little more experimental than just copying a straight recipe (though there is nothing particularly special about this I wouldn't think).

The idea is something dry and easy to drink, so I can toss a few bottles around to show off my first attempt at a real beer.
I winged the hops though, sort of guessed amounts for a lowish IBU. Should it be higher?

I went for like an Aussie lager kind of thing, but maybe a little more tasty. Though I will use an ale yeast as its hot here in NQLD and I don't have the patience for a lager yeast anyway.

First Partial Idea 23L Batch

Original Gravity (OG): 1.045 (°P): 11.2
Final Gravity (FG): 1.011 (°P): 2.8
Alcohol (ABV): 4.42 %
Colour (SRM): 5.3 (EBC): 10.4
Bitterness (IBU): 21.3 (Average)

42.55% Pale Malt (2kg)
31.91% Liquid Malt Extract - Light (1.5kg)
21.28% Flaked Rice (1kg)
4.26% Caramalt (200g)

0.7 g/L (15g) Pride of Ringwood (8.3% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil)
0.7 g/L (15g) Cascade (7.8% Alpha) @ 15 Minutes (Boil)


Single step Infusion at 66°C for 60 Minutes. Boil for 60 Minutes

Fermented at 24°C with Safale US-05


Recipe Generated with BrewMate

Any comments/improvements? (Go easy on me)

[jello]

Looks alright to me.
24C is a little on the warm side. How do you keep your brews cool while fermenting?

[squirt in the turns]

Looks good to me too. For the moderate OG of 1.045, your 21.3 IBUs would be leaning slightly towards the sweet side. However, that reasonably big whack of rice will probably dry it out a bit, so you should get what you're looking for. I've never mashed with rice, so can't back that up with experience, though.

Definitely agree with Jeff's comment about the temps. US-05 does a good job of cleanly fermenting faux-lagers, if you can keep the temp under about 18c. At 24 it probably won't give anything like the result you're after - you'll get all sorts of funky esters. I struggled with temperature control until I just got an old (working) fridge. Unless you want to stuff around trying to insulate the fermenter, freezing bottles of saline solution and other wacky methods, the fridge is really the only way to go. Otherwise, you're looking at a lot of effort trying to control the temp in the tropics.

[Oliver]

+1 to all that's been said, in particular about the temperature. Definitely try to ferment about 18C and not above 20C if you can help it.

I've had US-05 down to about 15C with no apparent problems, because I don't have heating. Fermented out very nice and clean.

The 15-min addition of Cascade should give a nice hint of hop, but not be overly aromatic.

It's a pretty big partial. Seems like you'll be doing AG before you know it because it's not that much of a step from where you are now!

Cheers,

Oliver

[Gill]

Yeah, 24C was what I put into the program as a worst case estimate. But it is definitely over 20C. Might have to look at using ice blocks or something.. Need to find an area, maybe the bathtub.

Even if the beer is a little sweet, it could impress a few people as an unusual flavour to anyone who isn't used to it. So long as it shouldn't be too sweet. I just based it on the Brewmate style guide, which said an aussie lager upper limit would be around 20..

EDIT:

Seems like you'll be doing AG before you know it because it's not that much of a step from where you are now!

This one may still be a little bit off, and chances are it won't work (knowing my luck) so not that close

[jello]

Yeah, 24C was what I put into the program as a worst case estimate. But it is definitely over 20C. Might have to look at using ice blocks or something.. Need to find an area, maybe the bathtub.

The bathtub and/or laundry tub can be quite effective. I've had success with the fermenter in the bathtub and a wet towel around it, and a desk fan The temperature outside was in the 30's. Just keep an eye on it.

This one may still be a little bit off, and chances are it won't work (knowing my luck) so not that close

Be optimistic mate. Just be ruthless about your sanitation. Manage your temperature as best you can. Be patient and keep the lid on.

[Gill]

That may have sounded pessimistic, but it was just me having a joke at myself. I'm quietly hopeful.

The main reason I'm making the jump so soon is that I wasn't really happy with the taste from my K&K batches, why bother with minor improvements on something flawed from the beginning

[Oliver]

... chances are it won't work (knowing my luck) so not that close

Luckily, mashing isn't rocket science so I'm sure it'll be a roaring success. The three partials that I've done have been my best beers to date.

Let us know how it goes.

Cheers,

Oliver

[rotten]

G'day mate.
I only ever brewed a few partials before I begun the very slippery slope to AG. Not saying you will, But
Anyways, if you don't want it too sweet I would up the bittering hops to get your IBU to 25-30 tops. Your extract will add more sweetness than you think, and the extra bitterness would help balance it a bit more, or at least make sure it's more balanced.
Your recipe looks good.
I'm planning on doing a Fosters AG clone using flaked rice soon, for no other reason then I can.
Cheers

[Gill]

Could I try this in a 10L pot with a small boil and add water, or should I wait until I can get a bigger pot?

Rotten, I did consider upping the PoR to 20-25g, bringing the IBU to 26.5-31.7. You would recommend that?

I'm looking for something quite low-moderate to start with, but I'm not familiar with the practical side of the IBU scale

[rotten]

Could I try this in a 10L pot with a small boil and add water, or should I wait until I can get a bigger pot?

Rotten, I did consider upping the PoR to 20-25g, bringing the IBU to 26.5-31.7. You would recommend that?

I'm looking for something quite low-moderate to start with, but I'm not familiar with the practical side of the IBU scale

I would recommend bringing the IBU up for sure. I regularly brew beers with 60 IBU, you just need to balance it with your malt, which your extract will do easily IMHO.
Have a look at TL's partial instructions, it helped me heaps. You can do a 10 ltr boil and add water, there was a good formula I used a few times here somewhere, I will try and dig it up for you.
Cheers

[rotten]

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=10045

It'a a bit scary but that's what I did for my first partial, still looking for TL's link, will just edit this post if i find it.

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=7720

found it. A bit scary for me again, but these guys helped me heaps so I'm happy to help as well.
I hope

[Gill]

yes I've read through that second one, I'm pretty sure I'll do that

I also found this:

from here http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=35877&st=0&p=505410&#entry505410

If I have read this right.. If I used these ingredients in a 8L boil (probably pushing it), then my SG at this point should be about 1.130. According to this graph my hop utilization factor will be about a half..
Did I actually read it right? Should I double the hops for such a small boil? Should I just forget about it and do a tiny batch? Or am i worrying too much and should I just stick with the original plan?

EDIT: Rather than mucking around with that table (that was silly, but hey, engineering student ), I played around with my equipment in beersmith (upgraded from brewmate in the last few hours) and got the following:

60.00 g Pride of Ringwood [9.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 5 19.8 IBUs
30.00 g Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 6 3.0 IBUs
for a total of 22.8IBUs

I know this is back low again. But I was hesitant to make it too high as I may have made some mistakes and it could turn out too bitter
Turning out a little more complicated (but fun) than I first thought

[bullfrog]

You could save money on hops by doing two boils. One at around 1.040 for your hop additions and another for the rest of your wort to sanitise it. 90g of hops is a lot more expensive than 30-40!

[Oliver]

If I used these ingredients in a 8L boil (probably pushing it), then my SG at this point should be about 1.130.

You'll just add the extract at at flamout, I'd expect. There's no reason to boil the extract, although some may do so. So don't count that when calculating the SG in the 8 litres.

That should save you some money on hops, and doing a double boil

BTW, how are you finding BeerSmith after BrewMate?

Cheers,

Oliver

[Gill]

Good ideas.
I'm liking beersmith, theres a lot more settings and a lot more control. Its also harder to get a hold of, but I think I'm getting there.

How can I calculate how much I will need to add in this case?

Also, what is the reason for needing more at higher SGs? Less absorption of the AAs?

[Gill]

By the way, how hard is it to tell if its bitter enough at the end of the boil?
Would I be able to taste it and know whether to boil it a bit longer and throw some more in, or would that require a bit more practice (I've only done a few kit brews so far, though I have tasted them all)

[jello]

By the way, how hard is it to tell if its bitter enough at the end of the boil?
Would I be able to taste it and know whether to boil it a bit longer and throw some more in, or would that require a bit more practice (I've only done a few kit brews so far, though I have tasted them all)

Yes. it is my understanding that you can guage bitterness by taste. but if it isn't bitter enough, do you really want to boil for ANOTHER 60min?

[Gill]

Ha, no, but I'd throw a few more in and see how 15mins went

[Oliver]

How can I calculate how much I will need to add in this case?

Sorry, how much of what? If you're talking hops, then BeerSmith should be able to calculate it all for you. You'll just need to fiddle around a bit to allow for the 8-litre boil but 23-litre (or whatever) final volume.

Also, what is the reason for needing more at higher SGs? Less absorption of the AAs?

In general, hop utilisation (the amount of bitterness extracted) reduces as the SG increases. Have a read of Palmer, in particular 5.5 Hop Bittering Calculations.

Would I be able to taste it and know whether to boil it a bit longer and throw some more in.

Hmmmm, I don't think I'd be able to. At the end of the boil the SG will probably be higher than once the wort is diluted and likewise it will be quite bitter because you haven't yet diluted it. Even after it's all diluted you're still going to have a lot of sweetness that won't be there after fermentation and that will mask the bitterness in the unfermented wort. I'd trust BeerSmith to figure it all out for me and make any adjustments next time.

Hope this helps rather than confuses!

Oliver