Guinness

[dlarratt]

GUINNESS DRAUGHT
Ruby and Cream. Black and White. Two distinct parts, one perfect pint.
They say a unique mix of nitrogen and carbon dioxide helps create GUINNESS Draught's liquid swirl that tumbles, surges and gradually separates into a black body and smooth creamy head.

The rise and fall of our bubbles has perplexed PhD physicists and homebrewers. They say focus on the taste - with an initial malt and caramel flavour, GUINNESS Draught finishes with a dry roasted bitterness. Going by taste I can't replicate it.

I've tried many times to capture this in my own homebrew, but although enjoying the stouts I've made (often closer to porters than stouts), I have failed to replicate anywhere near the black body and smooth creamy head and the general thickness of the tar. Some Irish guy was trying to tell me they pasturise it.......

DECLARED INGREDIENTS
Barley. Water. Hops. Yeast. And a little bit of GUINNESS magic.

Could the magic be pasturisation? I thought that was for milk products, but creaminess is a thick milkiness.

How can I get closer in my endevours to make this enchanting liquid lunch & dinner, GUINNESS?

Please help me.....working in London & Dublin has left me craving for it.

Thanks,
Dave

[geoffclifton]

Hi Dave.
I just Googled 'home brew guiness clone' mis spelt 'n all 'n got this. Google is your friend

Guinness Extra Stout Clone - by Tess & Mark Szamatulski, from the book "Clone Brews"

Specialty Grains:

12 oz Roasted Barley
4 oz 55 degree Lovibond British Crystal Malt
4 oz Flaked Barley
3 oz Acid Malt (Optional, will impart that slightly sour "Guinness" taste)

Crush specialty grains & steep in 150 degree F (65.5 degrees C) water for 20 minutes. Sparge grains with 1/2 gallon of water at 150 degrees, and bring water to a boil. Remove from heat and add:

Other Fermentables:

4 lb Mountmellick Light Malt Syrup
1.75 lb M&F Light DME

Stir well & then bring the wort back to a full boil, then add 1 oz Target hops (8.5% AA). Boil for 15 minutes, then add 1/2 oz East Kent Goldings hops (5% AA).

After another 30 minutes, add 1 tsp Irish Moss. Boil for 15 more minutes; then remove from heat.

Cool the wort down to 80 degrees (I prefer an immersion chiller, in which case, put it in the boiling wort 10 minutes before the end of the boil to sanitize.), then add the yeast:

Yeast Choice #1: Wyeast 1084 Irish Ale Yeast

Alternate: Wyeast 1098 British Ale Yeast

Primary fermentation should take about five days, but siphon into the secondary when fermentation slows.

The suggested priming agent for bottling is 1 & 1/4 cups M&F Light DME.

Original Gravity should be about 1.042 - 1.045, and Final Gravity should be about 1.009 - 1.011. SRM should fall about 54, and the final result should be about 4.2% ABV, with an IBU rate of 40.

----------------------

[rwh]

I'd like to point out one thing: Guinness Extra Stout and Guinness Draught are two different beers! People so often confuse them...

[DarkFaerytale]

RWH - is the only difference the nitrogen or do they have different grain bills?

[rwh]

As far as I'm aware, different grain bills. The draught is much thinner and lighter than the extra.

[DarkFaerytale]

cheers RWH

[dlarratt]

Thank Geoff for the recipe, but it is definitely the Guinness Draught I'm after and not the Extra Stout brew.
Thanks tp "rwh" for pointing that out.

[geoffclifton]

Same deal tho Dave.
Google 'Guinness Draught clone home brew'

http://www.skotrat.com/skotrat/recipes/ ... es/38.html

Brewing Method: All Grain
Yeast: WYEAST: Irish Ale
Yeast Starter: 1/2 US Gallon at high Krausen
Batch Size: 16 US Gallons
Original Gravity: 1.048
Final Gravity: 1.014
Alcohol Content: 4.4 %
Total Grains: 32 US Pounds
Color: 117.6
Extract Efficiency: 80 %
Hop IBU's: 37.8
Boiling Time: 90 minutes
Primary Fermentation: 7 days @ 60f
Secondary Fermentation: 7 days @ 55f
Additional Fermentation: 14 days in Brite tanks @ 40f

Grain Bill:

20.00 lb. BRIESS 2 ROW PALE
8.00 lb. Flaked Barley
4.00 lb. Roast Barley

Hop Bill:

4.00 oz. N. Brewer 6.9% 60 min

Mash Schedule:

Single Step:

90 minutes @ 158f
10 minutes @ 168F

Brewers Notes:

2 teaspoons Irish Moss in the boil

1 Bottle of soured Guinness Extra Stout in the boil To give it that true Guinness Souring.

Serve between 40-50f with a Guinness mix Nitrogen/Co2 mix.

AND

http://www.stoutbillys.com/stout/recipe ... FE6C8F.htm

Ingredients:

6 lbs John Bull Pale Malt Extract
1 lb Flaked Barley
1/2 lb Roasted Barley
1/4 lb Black Patent
1 oz Northern Brewer whole hops (7.7% alpha)
1 tsp gypsum
Wyeast #1084 (Irish Ale)
1.5 cups Pale Dry Malt Extract for priming

Procedure:

To 2 gal cold water add grains in bag, and gypsum. Bring to boil, boil 5 min., remove grains. Add hops, boil 45 min. Sparge into cold water to make 5 gal of wort. Rack cooled wort off of cold break, pitch yeast.

Specifics:

O.G.: 1.045
F.G.: 1.010

Comments:

Here's my interpretation of Guinness Pub Draught (refined after 5 iterations!).
This recipe represents the culmination of my year-long quest to replicate draught Guinness. It's close enough that my Guinness consumption will be significantly curtailed!

---------------------------------

Where were we before the net and a search engine, down the pub

Cheers, Geoff.

[dlarratt]

How does the Guinness mix Nitrogen/Co2 mix work?
Is that easy to do?
Is it on tap with soda-stream style pump?
Is it possible to replicate the widgets in the cans?

Cheers
DB

[BierMeister]

1. Nitrogen in the mix keeps the head from turning brown so quick. Thats it. This was told to me by a Guiness rep from the UK.
2. Only if you can get Nitrogen easily and cheaply.
3. No, not as far as I've ever heard.
4. No, not without a lot of money and a factory in china.

[Pale_Ale]

Since nitrogen is the most common gas in our atmosphere (way more nitrogen than oxygen) you'd think it would be cheap

[BierMeister]

Yes, but CO2 is a common waste product and can be caputured from most factories who are desperate to sell it rather than release it and make the world a hotter place.... Hang on a minute...

[WSC]

Anyone have a good Guinness Clone Kit and Kilo only though?

I have searched but can't find one.

[geebz]

last time i had a kilkenny from a can at the pub the bar lady poured it in a glass and put it on a vibrator/sonicator type thing to get the creamy head. She said they dont have the widget anymore. Anyone shed some light on the situation ? If they dont need a widget anymore there must be some way around it.

[wildschwein]

GUINNESS DRAUGHT

I've tried many times to capture this in my own homebrew, but although enjoying the stouts I've made (often closer to porters than stouts), I have failed to replicate anywhere near the black body and smooth creamy head and the general thickness of the tar. Some Irish guy was trying to tell me they pasturise it.......

DECLARED INGREDIENTS
Barley. Water. Hops. Yeast. And a little bit of GUINNESS magic.

Could the magic be pasturisation? I thought that was for milk products, but creaminess is a thick milkiness.

How can I get closer in my endevours to make this enchanting liquid lunch & dinner, GUINNESS?

Please help me.....working in London & Dublin has left me craving for it.

Thanks,
Dave

Hey Dave I'm definitely no Guinness expert but I have read in Charlie Papazian's The Home Brewer's Companion (Avon, 1994) that the secret ingredient is a soured double-strength Guinness (this is a high gravity Guinness fermented with lactobacillus and acetobacter bacterias) which is pasturised before it is added to the main beer at a rate of 3%.

Papazian claims that this is the x-factor that gives Guinness it's unique quality. It may be possible to simulate this at home. Perhaps use some of your initial wort and beef up the gravity without modifying the general composition, add your cultures, if you can get them ferment and then pasturise it at 77C for 30 minutes and add to your main brew at a rate of no more than 4%.

[Goofinder]

Hey Dave I'm definitely no Guinness expert but I have read in Charlie Papazian's "The Home Brewers Companion (Avon, 1994) that the secret ingredient is a soured double-strength Guinness (this is a high gravity Guinness fermented with lactobacillus and acetobacter bacterias) which is pasturised before it is added to the main beer at a rate of 3%.

Papazian claims that this is the x-factor that gives Guinness it's unique quality. It may be possible to simulate this at home. Perhaps use some of your initial wort and beef up the gravity without modifying the general composition, add your cultures, if you can get them ferment and then pasturise it at 77C for 30 minutes and add to your main brew at a rate of no more than 4%.

I've got the following recipe (haven't made it though) from The Homebrewer's Recipe Guide which involves some soured Guinness. Unfortunately al the recipes arel in imperial measurements, but here it is:

6 2/3 lbs (3 kg) dark liquid malt extract
24 oz (700 mL) soured Guinness stout
1/2 lb (225 g) crystal malt 80L
1/2 lb (225 g) roasted barley
1/2 lb 225 g) chocolate malt
2 oz (57g) kent goldings @60 min
1/2 cup maltodextrin
Irish ale yeast
Make up to 5 gallons (19 L)

Their 'quick souring' is done by putting it in a sterilised pint glass or something with a large open surface area and covering with a cloth held on by a rubber band. You start it off 2-3 days before you're going to brew and add it to the boil.

[wildschwein]

Yeah Goofinder that looks like it would work. I used to make sourdough cultures and ginger beer plants simply by covering them with a clean cloth and waiting for five days and they're usually a mix of wild yeasts and lactobacillus. So I reckon your method looks easier than what I wrote.

[rwh]

Another way to get a souring culture is to put in a bit of cracked grain. The souring bacteria are on the grain.

[Iron-Haggis]

last time i had a kilkenny from a can at the pub the bar lady poured it in a glass and put it on a vibrator/sonicator type thing to get the creamy head. She said they dont have the widget anymore. Anyone shed some light on the situation ? If they dont need a widget anymore there must be some way around it.

The most recent batch of Kilkenny at my work still has the widgets in them. I really don't think they no longer have the widgets. The reason you get the creamy head is because of the release of nitrogren during the pour. If it was as simple as just adding nitrogren into the can then they would never have made the widgets.

[geebz]

never again will i believe the local barmaid. HA