Brew started Fermenting in CUBE!

[rotten]

G'day all.
I brewed on Sunday night after thinking whether I should all day. Everything went well, it was a TTL grain bill with dramatic alterations to the the hop schedule. Change a hop here and there, up IBU's, flavour and aroma etc. I use a method that I have coined 'slow chill'. Basically into a cube, into laundry sink with ice bottles where it sits overnight after a few changes of water, then drain into fermentor and pitch yeast.

This has worked for countless brews so far. This time around I couldn't drain into fermentor for a few days so it sat at room temps. The cube was sucked in, then it pushed out slightly. F*** I think was the word used. I don't think it's infected, I think it's a wild yeast or maybe enough of my previous yeast somehow made it to the cube?

I did release pressure quite a bit when cooling which is normal practise for me. Then again after it began swelling. (now cringes)

I drained into fermentor today after bottling another batch and pitched a 1469 yeastcake. It smells different, tastes fine though. I'm not tossing it just yet.

My OG has dropped 10 points in the cube

Any no chillers or others have any suggestions?
Cheers & Merry Christmas

[Bum]

I use a method that I have coined 'slow chill'. Basically into a cube, into laundry sink with ice bottles where it sits overnight after a few changes of water, then drain into fermentor and pitch yeast.

You're undoing pretty much all of the benefits of no-chilling here. Fill it, lid it, leave it. You need the heat to hang around early on to - get this - ensure that the wort is in the right shape to be able to withstand not having the yeast pitched immediately.

I don't think it's infected, I think it's a wild yeast or maybe enough of my previous yeast somehow made it to the cube?

Unless you wanted the wild yeast there it is infected - with wild yeast. Make no excuses or you'll get sloppy again in the future. Realise your beer is infected.

I drained into fermentor today after bottling another batch and pitched a 1469 yeastcake. It smells different, tastes fine though. I'm not tossing it just yet.

If you put it aside for a year or so and let it turn into a Tim Brooke Taylor Lambic-lord then it *might* be worthwhile fermenting it. Me, it never would have seen a fermenter and the cube would be binned. Make sure you nuke everything hardcore when you're done.

My OG has dropped 10 points in the cube

Your 1469 might have difficulty getting the jump on a wild yeast that is already multiplied and running that hard.

Best of luck, fella.

[rotten]

Unless you wanted the wild yeast there it is infected - with wild yeast. Make no excuses or you'll get sloppy again in the future. Realise your beer is infected.

Ouch, I knew that was coming.

Best of luck, fella.

Thanks. Sounds like I will need it.
Cube has been nuked twice already, going to re-do for the overnight stint.

I hereby vow to not release pressure from my cube again.

Do I have to top it up though with water if it's just overnight? This would alter my desired brew.
Cheers

[Bum]

I don't think it is entirely essential for the cube to be 100% full - just squeeze out the air you can (carefully, safety first, etc) and rotate it on its sides every 15 min or so early on and I think that's supposed to be good enough (assuming an appropriately sized cube here, obviously, 10L of wort in a 20L cube would be a worry). Works for me anyway and most of my cubes sit for about a week before pitch. If you do top up with water I hope you're using boiling water.

What I think is just as important as not opening the cube until you transfer it is stopping this slow-chill business - or at least not doing it until the cube gets below pasteurisation temps naturally. I've even been known to chuck a blanket on a cube to slow the cooling down when I'm feeling particularly paranoid (plus it keeps light out).

[rotten]

I have used this slow chill method since day dot. Not any more though. That plate chiller will be ordered sooner than I thought. This was the longest a brew has stayed in the cube due to work etc, I think I have been lucky until now.

So squeeze air out, rotate several times, and DON'T release anything.

Sounds like I'm a no chiller for a while.

Thanks mate

P.S. I still won't chuck it, got heaps of empty bottles in the shed.

[Bum]

G'day all.
I don't think it's infected, I think it's a wild yeast or maybe enough of my previous yeast somehow made it to the cube?
[snip]
My OG has dropped 10 points in the cube

I've been thinking about this. Shouldn't 10 points have been showing a decent krausen? Do non-yeast infections eat up our sugaz? You know what, rotten? I stand by my previous points about temp and not letting the cube breathe but you should maybe wait for someone else to weigh in on the exact nature of your infection.

[rotten]

It had Krausen, I can definately confirm that. It was creamy, 2-3 cm high, just started turning darker from hops i suspect when i transferred it. It would seem at the moment that the 1469 is trying to dominate, it is a powerful yeast afterall. A few hrs after yeastcake was pitched it had a dark krausen, now white areas are starting to emerge through it. 1469 is all I have used since it's release, 8 brews and counting. Not from same yeastcake, it has been split every time.

Cheers

[Bum]

Ah, your initial doubt as to "thinking" it wasn't an infection had me guessing.

[BribieG]

Bum's got it in one with the "slow chilling" method - I have one cube that has done over a hundred brews and never skipped a beat, but it sits hot initially and next day when it's down to about 34 I finish it off in the fridge down to pitching temperature and transfer to FV. The cube often sits there for three days, although I normally try to pitch within 24 hours.
Best of luck and hope the 1469 wins out. Fine it to buggery and drink young

For nuking the cube I'd recommend filling it with a strong solution of hot napisan - the oxygen bleach will zap any organic life in there and you'll see the foam oozing out of the top of the cube. Leave overnight then a fairly strong dose of Starsan. Every few brews I pour half a cup of short grain rice into the cube with napisan and hot water and shake / sandblast the inside.

[hirns]

Rotten, I was using a similar method, but then modified it to adding 2x2l of frozen ice(preboiled) as I brew for 23l but get 19l after boil and trub loss. The 4L of ice along with the bath brings the temp down a quickly as a submersible chiller (20/30min) so that I can pitch the yeast ASAP.

Cheers

Hirns

[rotten]

Thanks Hirns, I have taken heaps from this experience.
Good news is the 1469 took hold and took over. Racked it about an hr ago, FG reached 1008 which is lower than it should have. Tasted O.K, a bit bananary, but I did let the temp run high over last two or three days. Will Fine to buggery while in cold chill, then fine again. Won't bottle this for at least two weeks, while leaving it in cold chill.
I use gelatine by the way.
Don't normally do this to 1469, but will male a serious acception this time around.
Cheers

P.S. It did smell fine, while slightly banana in taste, not over the top.

[rotten]

Bottled this today after ccing for nearly 3 weeks, it was even frozen for a few days. If that don't drop stuff out nothin will. Will update with taste test in a few weeks.
Cheers

[rotten]

Just cracked open the first bottle of this brew. It's drinking fine, no odd smells or flavours, even the banana has gone.
Cheers

[Bum]

That's great news! Sounds like the 1469 is more vicious than I gave it credit for.

For interest's sake, would you be able to hold on to one bottle for longer than you normally might to see how it travels and let us know?

[rotten]

Anything for you Bum

My AG brews aren't lasting long, but if I can save a tasty brew for Billy, I can save a once dodgy brew for tasting-testing later.
Cheers

[Scoot49]

Just out of curiosity.... what is this cube? lol

[Bum]

Generally a 20ish litre, square (hence 'cube') water container. Regularly used in brewing for no-chilling wort. Probably raises more questions than it answers but you'll know what it all means when it become relevant to you and how you brew.

Some brewers often seem to refer to the same sized jerry can shaped containers as cubes too. Cubes are also regularly used for lagering a brew rather than for no-chilling. You probably don't need to know these things right now, I'm just adding them here to stop any pedants from pedding.

[Scoot49]

ah very nice, thank you for clearing that up

There is quite a bit of variation in methods and alternatives.

Am really excited to just enhance my knowledge. REALLY can't wait to get my Canadian blonde into the bottle so I can try it in a month or so..... first brew without the standard pre mix stuff....

[rotten]

I'm just adding them here to stop any pedants from pedding.

I just learnt two new words, good ones too Bum.
Isn't google great

[Bum]

There is quite a bit of variation in methods and alternatives.

Tip of the iceberg, fella. So many ways to do pretty much every step of your brew - after drinking the product, that is one of the best parts of this hobby.

Am really excited to just enhance my knowledge. REALLY can't wait to get my Canadian blonde into the bottle so I can try it in a month or so

That's what we like to hear!