did my first ag now for the next step!

[bangers]

I finally had a go at ag brewing I did a coriander amber ale bottled it yesterday .I went off and got a 15ltr barrel esky to use as my mash tun followed the instruction given and produced a pretty good unit.Sat arvo going to do an all grain pale ale and while i was at my hb store lashed out to get some extra grains to make my first ag german pilsner! heres the twist The recipe calls for a protien-developing step mash! I'm starting to get the gist of the instructions sxcept for one step of the process.
"Using a protien develpoing step mash add 3.8ltrs of 54.4c water to the crushed malt.stabilise at 50c and hold for 30mins.simple enough!Add 2ltrs of boiling water stabilise to 68-69c and hold for 60mins. get that part too ! This is the puzzler ! Add heat (how) and mash out to 74c .I know that naked flames and plastic eskys dont mix so is this process necessary or can I just use the first 2 parts then sparge? or do I move the contents to my boil pot heat up and return to the tun not sure any ideas?

[Tipsy]

Not trying to be a smartarse, but maybe you should just do a couple more single infusion mashes. You can make very good pilsners with well modified grains using this simple method.

[bangers]

Righto!,
I've already bought my grains ect from my hb store,my grains have already been milled by the store so their ready to go. so if I go with a single infusion mash should be o.k. still gotta boil add hops ect just the intial mash was a bit different.

[rwh]

If you want to go ahead with the step mash, you've got three options that I can think of.

1. Forget the mash out. The only real difference it will make is you'll lose a few points of extraction efficiency.
2. Add boiling water to get you up to mash out temp (if you have sufficient volume in your tun).
3. Do a decoction. Which means pulling some of the thick part of the mash, boiling it on the stove, and returning it to the mash to raise the temp.

[drsmurto]

I've done infusion step mashes before

Start off at 50-52, add enough boiling water to get to the sacc temp (65) and then add more boiling water to hit mash out, which for me is 78C.

I believe Kevnlis does a decoction to reach mash out which in this case is basically just starting your runoff, boiling it and adding it back in. Am sure he can explain in more detail how he does it.

I use the 52-65-78 regime when using Wey pils malt which i find produces a lot of chill haze and this methodology eliminates it (altho polyclar treatment will too).

[Kevnlis]

Yeah thats right doc, I always decoct my mash out step.

Contrary to rwh's sound advice, I believe the mash out also gives a clearer run off and better final result. Also DO NOT as he suggests, boil any grain with the mash out step! This boil should be as thin (I like to just boil run off) as possible to avoid protein/starch haze and tannin extraction.

If you are using Beersmith it will do the maths for you.

I just select "double infusion..." (don't worry about the body selection, you can choose your own temps later) then I adjust each step to my liking.

As doc also mentioned a bit higher than 50C seems to yield better results, I usually shoot for 53C as my strike temp because if I do miss the temp I am usually slightly under not over.

For a pilsner you probably want to be around 63-65 C for the sacc rest and 78C for the mash out and sparge temp. If you can keep the grain bed up around 78C you will get a better run off in my experience.

You also need to change the "type" of step for the mash out from "infusion" to "decoction". It will calculate the rest for you.

Then you simply run off until you get clear wort, then boil the stated volume of clear wort (make sure you get a full rolling boil and leave it to boil for a few minutes to be sure it is at 100C) and return the boiled liquor to the tun and stir like mad for a few minutes, then let it rest for 10 minutes or so and start your run off as per normal.

[rwh]

I don't get it. Why is this last decoction any different to any of the others?

[Kevnlis]

Well, the mash out decoction has to be thin to avoid extracting further starch, as there are no longer enzymes to break it down.

If it is not thin (or thick) enough a decoction will also cause extraction of proteins and tanins which I avoid by filtering the liquor through the grainbed.

[drsmurto]

At 78C the liquid is less viscous than at 65 or whatever your sacc rest temp is. This allows the liquid to run off clearer/faster. From a purely scientific point, the higher the temp of a liquid the higher the solubility of the sugars. The other point is that a temp of 75 or over stops enzyme activity.

[bangers]

thanks again kev!
I gunna go with your plan mate I read up on decotian didnt quite grasp it at first ,but your explanation un complicates things a fair bit ta mate!